Judaism 101 - Knowledge and Belief

1:56 In other words, let's say I was born in Syria. What would my belief be about people who live in Israel? They're the infidels. They're the people that have to be destroyed. So if the beginning of your belief is that you don't really believe, but somewhere along the line somebody told you that you have to believe. This is what you believe in. Now all your questions start, and you're not really going to have good answers to those questions. Because what's the whole thing built on? It's built on the thing that I don't really believe in to begin with. I'm just saying that I believe in it in order to believe in it, which, as Shai pointed out, is not real belief anyway. Fair. So what's the so what? What do we have to do now? Rabbi? You're going to have to think. In other words, before we even talk about God, right? Before we talk about religion We have to talk about belief.

2:46 What exactly does it mean to believe in something? And I think Kramer, you're saying it very well. Let's really narrow it down. Is there a difference between belief and knowing? In other words, is there a difference between yediyah and emuna? Yediyah means that I know something. Emuna means I believe in something. So the question is, what does belief mean? Shai. You can't necessarily identify what you're believing in. There's not necessarily proof for it. But if you know it, then there's proof for it. If I know it, then why do I have to believe in it? You don't. So then, amuna becomes irrelevant Because once I know something to be true Once I know something to be true, why do I need amuna? But some things it's impossible to identify. That I know that it's. That's maybe you're right, maybe you're wrong. We'll have to see. But it's at least a fair point that you're making. Kushner It could actually be right, and as if I only believe in it Maybe it's not true.

3:54 But then the question is, what's the value of belief? In other words, if I know it's true, great. If I don't know it's true, maybe that's fine. What's the value of belief? Because then what's about to happen is you're going to say, I don't know if it's true. I believe in it, but do I really believe in it? Do I just say I believe in it? What if I was born five hundred miles that way? You see how it devolves very quickly? Abzis. I think when you have a background of something you're believing in. Whether it's God or the fact that Israel's armed or not armed. When something else happens along those lines You just believe it to be true. For example, let's say you've learned for years, like all these stories, like God did this for these people, and they saw the reason, they knew it.

4:42 Then you'll assume that if something similar happens to you, you'll believe it's along those lines too. So what exactly is the definition of belief? I'm not sure what you're saying. It's like it's due. Okay. So what you mean to say is as follows, and I want to make sure that I understand this. Correct me if I'm getting it wrong. There's some room over there. So what you're saying is as follows: I know God is real. I know that all the promises in the Torah are real. By the way, I'm not sure how you know that, but let's assume that you can for a second. Now your only thing is, and therefore, based on that yiddia, I have emuna that the things that are happening are in line with that original plan. So I know God is real. Somehow I know the Torah is real, so therefore I see things happening today and I believe that's a vision of the Torah.

5:47 For example, I know ten different people that got into car crashes, and then within six months, something really good happened to them. They're saying, "Oh, the reason why I got into car crashes is something better was supposed to happen." Good. So in other words, you are saying I don't know that something better was supposed to happen to them, but that's something I have a moon in. Maybe. Pensky, anything before? Just say that loud. I'm a little deaf. Believe might be something that other people would attest to. That you can say, "I believe this," and I know is more of. So if we know something, then everybody agrees on it. I'm with you so far, and if I believe in it, other people might object. So what's the value of belief? It's something that you have an opinion on, but someone else might argue. So this belief you're saying is very personal.

6:38 Knowledge you're saying is very impersonal. The knowledge that the stender exists, we should all agree on. We can empirically test the fact that the stender exists. My belief in the stender would be my personal relationship with it. What would it be? See that. That's where it gets a little weak. Because what exactly is my belief in the shtender? If I know that it exists, why do I even need belief at that point? Believe it's helping. Believe you're learning. Believe there's a higher power. But the question is then, if I only believe in a higher power. Good. Maybe yes, maybe no. But then, what you're really saying is, I have no idea if this thing is true, but for no reason at all I believe that it's true. The problem with that is, if you were born five hundred miles that way You would believe the exact opposite.

7:31 But then the question is At some point, you're going to ask yourself, maybe, what's the value of that belief? In other words, if the only reason I believe is because I was born in Tinek to this family, and if I was born in Syria, I'd probably think that it was a mitzvah to kill me. So gets a little It falls apart. It's a little shaky. So I think it's something a little bit different to what Pinsky said. The knowledge thing. I don't think it's based on personal or impersonal things because there are people that believe that Earth is flat. But I know. Kyrie Irving. I'm just saying, for example. So I don't think that works. So I think it's more of something that I know. Something that I know is true. But if I know it's true But just because I know it doesn't make it true.

8:30 Then how do you know? You got a proof. You hear the problem? But what I'm saying is If you know It's true, but other people. Why would they disagree with me? Do they have a different scientific fact? So I know something to be true, but I don't know it. Do you hear why this is such an important conversation, Sam? We're all walking around. People go, "I believe in God." I'm like Really? What does that mean? Well, do you know he exists? Of course not. I believe it. Why? I don't know. It gets at some point It might fall apart. Akeiva, right? I'd say knowledge is more like the way the world is versus belief being the lens through which you view it. That's fascinating. You're more along the lines of what Pinsker is saying now. Is belief a personal relationship? It's the way I choose to interpret particular facts.

9:31 Maybe. That's at least meaningful, but it requires a lot to think about. In other words, it's like, well, do you know that God exists? Is that knowledge that you have? Ist die Mitzvah, leida es Hashem oder lahamin? Hashem? It's going to make a big difference because if the mitzvah is lahamin, then what does that mean? Do I? How could I relate to something that I don't even know? At the very least, it's a meaningful conversation. We'll do a couple more. Honestly, I don't believe there's anything. Do you think you know? Like I stand. I think. I think I know. I. I think I know that gender exists. I believe. I believe in the gender, but it can also be based on evidence. Like, the Earth is round. I never actually went into a spaceship, went all the way out, saw the Earth is round. Based on evidence that was given to me by scientists, like easily search up right now, I believe the Earth is round.

10:21 But you don't. In other words, in your world, when you're walking around, you might fall off the edge. Is a possibility. There's a possibility that the Earth is flat. I never tested it out. I don't believe it. I don't think anyone believes it. But I know some people that believe it. Fine. They dribble basketballs in Brooklyn. Some people believe it But based on the so you don't know that so you're just in other words in your world we don't have knowledge that the world is round we have a belief that the world is round but it's based on a knowledge that somebody else tested and I'm choosing to believe those people. But last time, Neil Armstrong knows because he was on the moon So he saw it. Maybe he was on the moon. Maybe you believe that he was. You hear what I'm saying? Knowing ascribes a higher level of certainty to the veracity of a claim.

11:15 Belief is like a much lower level of certainty. You say I believe. Belief is knowledge with less certainty. Why would you believe it then? Because I want to believe something. I can value the psychological need that you have to believe. But then I might also value the psychological need that the person who wants to kill you has. Even as just a person, I would choose to believe those things. We'll do two more. Zimmerman. So in other words, belief means I've. Belief means I've got to tilt towards this side. I've got to tilt towards that side. I'm choosing to go this way. I have reason to believe that global warming is real and climate change is important to combat. I got scientists, some at least, that say it's a hoax But I believe that it's real. I don't really know if it's real. But I'm going to choose to live my life that way, even though I don't know.

12:23 I'm going to go spend all that extra money on a hybrid car because I choose to believe that climate change is a real problem. Is that what you're saying? You hear the problem with what you're saying Schiff? And the reason why it's personal is because some people choose to be convinced by people are just convinced differently by other things. One person might be If you put down facts about reasons why global warming might be real Some people who like specific types might be more attracted to those ideas. So you're saying a certain person might Because of a particular psychological background that he has, he might have a particular propensity to believe in climate change. He's a person who has other psychological backgrounds. Maybe he comes from a certain type of family with certain political leanings. His knowledge is that it's real. He's drawn to that. He's drawn more that way, so he chooses to believe that way. It's not just that he's fifty-fifty and he's going to go with that.

13:22 So you're sitting here in Mavasara today. You happen to be born to Jewish parents. You happen to be brought up in Jersey. You happen to find yourself now in your shalayim. You're this way, but you could equally be Islamic or you could equally be Christian. And so then if somebody came to you and said, "Well, why did you choose this way?" your only answer would be Just I was born to that kind of family. " Right, but it's not that's not the only reason. You're also like You hear a lot of I don't know, hearing from a dam, and they offer you proof, some like why God is real. If you were born in Texas, you may never hear this. You're born into it. But you're also. It's not. You're fed. You were born into it. You happened to be luck of the draw. You were born into it. And now you've been given proofs.

14:11 Exactly. Good. So now. Makes sense to you. So now at that point, do you know it or do you believe it? Once you've been given the logical proofs, you believe it. And you don't know it. Your belief is rooted in what? In an accident of history. Your belief is rooted in things that seem reasonable. But if you were born five hundred miles that way, it would be equally reasonable. Sure. But that it now becomes arbitrary. It is arbitrary. And you might go with that route. You might in your life say, 'Really, it's all arbitrary,' and the fact that I choose to believe it is really just there's no real reason I choose to believe it. If almost everyone here was born in a very highly Islamic country. The odds are they wouldn't find Judaism on their own. The odds are some people don't. But that's exactly what we're struggling with. In other words, at some point, if my belief system is arbitrary, that may not be the best foundation to build something on.

15:06 Up is Zitner, and then I gotta move on. So the first point I was gonna make is to follow up what he's saying If you could be born into a Jewish family and you'll hear all this year from all the rabbis, but if you were to go out and learn about Christianity and learn about all the Muslims and all the facts in their religion, you would come to the conclusion that all the facts they learn from all the religions The most logical one with the most facts would be Judaism. So in other words, you're saying that at the end of the day, even if you're right, you happen to accidentally be born in this time period, but at the end of the day, you've been given enough logical proofs that Judaism is more true than any other religion. Do you know it, or do you believe in it? But I would say that the people at Har Sinai that saw God didn't believe in God.

15:55 I'm going to ask you to hold off on that for a couple of minutes because we're going to discuss that, God willing, today. Sinner was my last one, and then I got to move on. Father. Sinner. I think one of the issues here is that people have this notion that they can't know and believe at the same time. I definitely think you can, but I want to know what the definitions are so that it allows me to do both. To believe in something is to commit yourself to a line of thinking or to a way of life through conceived notions that either you developed yourself or other people have handed to you, or you've been exposed to throughout the course of your life. I'm going to cut you off because that's a great place for us to start. Thank you. You'll see why in a minute. What you said was spot on.

16:44 What Sittner said is he spoke again just very broadly for a second before we get deep into it. He said belief is a concept of leading a life based on conceived notions, either that things you've worked out yourself or that assumptions that you're taking from other people. And that's where I'd like to start today's share. There are basically two approaches. Both are correct. Do which one works for you, but there are two approaches throughout Jewish history to the notion of how exactly we come to believe in this. One is called mesora And the other is called hakira I'm going to explain to you the advantages and the disadvantages of both, and then we'll pause to work it out together. First is mesora. What's the advantage of mesora? The advantage of mesora is as follows. There's a fundamental arrogance. That hubris exists when it comes to all rational thinking.

17:45 And that is that the mind can only contain that which can be explained. So for example The mind can contain this table. Why? Because the table is finite. And the mind can only explain rationally that which is finite. The limitation of intellect. Is that it cannot contain that which is beyond intellect. I want to be clear. What I don't mean is as follows. I don't mean that when something is illogical, that you get to say, "Oh, the mind just can't contain it." What I do mean to say is as follows. When it comes to your most wild and extreme imaginations You can only entertain. That which is so. Let's take a unicorn for example. Does a unicorn exist? But horns exist and horses exist. So what can we imagine? What can we conceive of? We can put two things together. Right? Whether there was or there wasn't, that's not the point. The point is I can take something that has never existed, as long as the things it's made up of have existed. All I'm doing is putting together pieces that have already always existed.

19:05 And so, in the world of imagination, you can't imagine something that can't exist. You can only imagine something that doesn't exist. Does that make sense? Kushner. So now, the limit of the intellect. If we're going to posit that there is such a thing as a God, which again, we have not defined what God is, and we haven't defined what existence is. That's going to be the next couple of shiurim. But let's imagine for a moment that there is something called God. The challenge of the human intellect is The mind could not possibly fathom it. So when we approach God logically, and what I mean to say is intellectually, by definition, you have to recognize the flaw in what you're attempting to do Because there would be no way to wrap your mind around this idea. The very definition of God means that it's going to be beyond comprehension. So when we say, for example, that God is infinite, what do we mean? Infinite means beyond the realm of time and space. Your mind exists within the realm of time and space.

20:09 So when somebody says, "I know God logically" What would the philosopher say back to them? How? How could you possibly know that? The nature of thinking is that it's muqbal; it's limited to the finite world. And what we're positing is that there's something more infinite. So by definition, the only way that you would ever be able to ascertain, and Abuzi says what you were saying earlier, the only way that you would ever be able to ascertain the truth of such a statement would be if you moved beyond the realm of the intellect. So these, for those that argue that there's a Masora Let's value just for a moment what they're attempting to do, which is a wild thing that they're attempting to do. They're saying I recognize. I want to be clear what they're not doing. This is what they're not doing. They're not saying.

20:57 I know this because my parents told me, and my grandparents told me, and their parents told them. That's the way it's always been presented to us, no? But that's so short of what it's actually doing. What it's actually doing is so much more profound than that. It only the conversation only begins, right? Because they recognize the limit of human intellect, and if you don't recognize the limit of human intellect, then you're really saying the only things that exist are things that I can measure. You understand the challenge So in other words, I will not relate to something that I can't measure. And the problem, as you will soon see, is when it comes to measurable things in this world. Most important things in this world are beyond the realm of measure. That's the advantage of going with Masaora. It recognizes the limit of the intellect.

21:52 What's the disadvantage of Masaora? The disadvantage is as follows. It's not personal. My experience, let's just say with God for a second. My experience with God is not because I've interacted with God But because who interacted with God But because thousands of years ago, my ancestors at Har Sinai interacted with God. So what does that say about my godly experience? It's not personal. You understand the disadvantage? If you only come and say, if somebody says to you "What's your logical reason for belief in God?" Your answer would be as follows: I believe in the limit of the human intellect. For whatever reason, which we're going to get to, I trust this Masora. Maybe you should, maybe you shouldn't. But for now, let's just posit that you trust the Masora. So I trust the Masora because there's no way on my own I could come to a belief in God. It would be irrational. It would be too big for logic.

22:51 But what's my godly experience? Me personally, I have no godly experience. I've never interacted with God. I've never encountered God. I have nothing to do with God. It's just that thousands of years ago, God revealed Himself to my ancestors, the Arizni, and said, 'Don't do boerah on Shabbos.' So now I don't do boerah on Shabbos. Wrap leather straps on your arms, so I wrap leather straps on my arms. Mumble some words from a book, so I mumble some words from a book. Learn archaic texts from a Gemara, so I do it. But really, really, why? It's nothing to do with me personally. It's just that there's a tradition that goes back thousands of years. I'll stop here just for a second. Make sure we're all on the same page. Questions, comments, reactions. But this idea of a summer camp, people at the very least assume that we do these things because people a thousand years ago had a reason.

23:38 People don't just start ridiculous practices. So let's assume that thousands of years ago, when they established that mesora Thousands of years ago, when they established that mesora, they did it because they had a reason. But me I'm just working off of the assumption that they had a reason. And that reason doesn't really pertain to me in my life. I'm not really connected or kasher to that reason. I'm just doing it because they did, and for whatever reason, I've chosen to believe that particular tradition. You hear the challenge? Koshner. Good. So fine, I'm with you. That's what we call an indirect proof. In other words, I'm not proving God because it would be ridiculous to even try. The limit of the human intellect could not possibly conceive of something called God. But I believe, and I have reasonable, I have a reasonable Logical basis to believe that this event I've seen, I happened. We're going to discuss what those reasons would be because those reasons need to be worked out very well if I'm going to choose to follow it.

24:41 But me personally, I've never interacted with God. I have no godly experience in my life. I'm not kasher really to God. It's just that thousands of years ago they were. So I somehow have chosen to believe that tradition that this is a good thing to do with my life, so I'm doing it. And as I'm with you, I can prove even intellectually, even logically, the Masaora. You would have to do it. It's no different than Abraham Lincoln. In other words, I could choose for whatever logical reasons to believe in Abraham Lincoln, but if I'm going to go live my life And really all of my life, because there is no claim as great as religion, right? Religion claims to be the be all and end all of everything. I'm going to have to be really strong in that Masora. See, it's not the same as climate change. Climate change, maybe I will buy a hybrid car, maybe I won't, right? But here we're saying something very profound. My entire life is going to be dominated by this thing.

25:30 So the only reason I'm doing that to begin with is because I recognize the limits of the human intellect, and I can only be connected through Masora. Sarkan. Why do you think that the human intellect can't just prove God? When you say you can't conceive of God because God is well How could it prove God? What would it even mean? What would the word "proof" mean that it could Right? There's. Well See, that's the thing. In other words, when it comes to the table, I can make it. I could prove it. I could. That's the point. I can never have that. That's my point. So I could logically speak about things around God. But to really conceive of the idea of God, to say that I actually know what I'm talking about, how would I get there? It is beyond the limits of the human mind. Now everyone who doesn't believe in God is going to jump all over this, right? And they're going to say, "You see, you believe in something that's beyond the realm of human comprehension. How could you even start to do that?" In other words, I believe they're going to tell you, "I believe only in that which I can measure, and only in that which exists."

26:29 I'm going to show you, over the course of the next couple of days and weeks, that they really believe in much more than that. But let's assume for now that's going to be their jumping point. Their jumping point is, 'You believe in something you can't comprehend.' The answer to that is: Just because I can't comprehend it doesn't mean it's not real. Why would I choose to believe in it? That's based on this tradition. The advantages, I recognize the limits of the human mind. The disadvantage is there's a huge gap between me and this thing. It's deeply impersonal. Abuzis. Who says like you can't like If let's say you show them a proof in Torah with kashrut with the fish that there you'll never find a fish like this. Wouldn't that be enough? Just the knowledge that somebody can give that no human being would be able to give proof that there's something greater.

27:24 It's an interesting thing that you're saying, but that's not really conceiving of God at all. Whereas there Let's say we could explain it somewhere else, but let's say we couldn't even. It doesn't make a difference. It was that I don't really know anything about God. All I know is I have this miraculous piece of information. Whether it is miraculous or isn't miraculous is besides the point. Let's just assume that these people were amazing when it came to knowing all of the species, however they did. The point is that your reaction to that would be, it's amazing that you have that knowledge. That's quite a jump to go. I believe in something that doesn't exist. That's beyond the realm of human comprehension. Hear what I'm saying? And so, just when people come and they say, here's this amazing thing in the Torah, it's meaningful as we're going to see, but it's indirect. It doesn't speak directly to the actual concept.

28:12 But if you're going to say something outside of human logic, will make God any more real than a tooth fairy? Meant nothing. Just saying, though. It's like at a certain point, like Zeus, where it says For sure. No documentation on Zeus. Why should I believe in our God any more than tooth? I absolutely agree with you 100%. In other words, you have to establish now, and as we're not doing this second. But in order to establish this line of thinking, the Mssora tradition that you believe in would have to be really legit. In other words, there's documentation around a lot of things. There's tons of sightings of Bigfoot. Lots of parents bring their kids up believing in the Tooth Fairy, maybe even Santa Claus. So at some point, from this perspective, you're going to have to ask yourself the question: If you're recognizing the limits of the human intellect, and now you're trying to engage in something that's beyond human comprehension, that's impossible. The only way you could know it is based on the Masora. So you have to test the veracity of that Masora very, very well to make sure that you actually believe in something that's true. Otherwise, it's just another mythology.

29:14 Fine. That's basically just going to be answered over time. I believe so. I hope so. Fine. But as I'm right now, all I'm trying to do is show you the path. What I'm presenting to you here today Again, this can be very challenging. That's why I want you guys to make sure you're at every single shiur, because we're going to lay out an entire structure of how to do this. So somebody comes to me and they say, 'I don't believe in God.' So you're going to know exactly. What are we talking about? We're talking about you don't believe in God because you don't trust the Masora. You don't believe in God because you think it can't be investigated logically. So you're already being given the two primary branches. Then the next thing you're going to do is say, what's the definition of God that you don't believe in? What would be a meaningful type of proof that you would need in order to believe in something? You see how all these things are going to be ordered. So that's the goal to give you an order.

30:14 Maybe none. Why? Only if they're making the claim that God exists. No! I'm saying the claim is that God does not exist. I'm saying God doesn't exist. I believe God does not exist. That's the inherent challenge here. In other words, if you believe that God existed Well then it would just be a question of finding him. If God takes up space, so then you go to the moon, he's not there. You go to Mars, he's not there. The question is, where is he? So at some point there would need to be a burden of proof on me because I'm suggesting God exists. Measure him. Where is he? Because I'm suggesting God doesn't exist. He's beyond the realm of logic and proof. He cannot be comprehended by the human mind. What would proof even look like? You understand? There's your question. If I was positing that there is a spaghetti monster, then the burden of proof would be on me to suggest that there is a spaghetti monster.

31:29 I'm saying that the beginning of any conversation has to be the understanding of the limitation of the human mind. What we're suggesting here, which might be too radical, is that this thing that we believe is out there, wherever 'there' means, whatever 'out' means. I'm using bad terminology on purpose. It doesn't exist. So therefore, we can't use the human mind to try to understand it. The disadvantage is I'm going to sit with thousands of people now over the course of the next fifty years of my life who say, 'Rabbi, I feel deeply disconnected from this thing because it has nothing to do with me.' I only believe in it because I believe in the Masorah. For whatever reason, I've chosen to believe in the Masorah. Let's say you have good logical reasons to believe in it, but at the end of the day. It's based on that, and I have no personal interaction with it. That's going to be the challenge if you only took this perspective. Yeah.

32:31 I think it's going to be the same exact conversation. Because if all you do is believe in mass revelation, then you don't know it, so what you have is this belief that this thing that's beyond human comprehension is real. But I don't really have any strong knowing background that says that it's real. In other words, if we're going with the Masora approach exclusively, which we won't be, obviously, that's why I keep saying exclusively. If we're going with the Masora approach exclusively, then naturally your response line is going to be You better have logical, demonstrable proof, whatever proof means for history, which is a fascinating conversation by itself. You better have logical, demonstrable proof to be able to get there. And if you don't, then the entire thing is already falling apart. Sam, then second. We're dealing with this whole conversation. We've been dealing with an omnipotent, omnipresent All-powerful God.

33:25 You just added in a whole bunch of things that I never said. And I never said that God was omnipotent. I never said He's omnipresent. I never said He's omnipowerful. The reason why I'm holding back from saying those things, Sam, is when I start to say those things, I better be able to defend them. So whatever God means right now, I haven't explained that on any level. I haven't talked about God as a Mitzvahreshon. I haven't spoken about God as a person or not a person, a being that has emotions. But I'm with you. We're saying here that he can't be comprehended by human minds. But isn't there always a possibility that he can? And he's just a regular person here who does really cool stuff. What if God was one of us? It's a famous song. Just a slob, like one of us. Just a stranger on the bus.

34:22 But then he wouldn't be God. In other words, if you believed that as God in person. Maybe I would personally consider that idolatrous. I wouldn't go that route. But it's a fascinating conversation. Many people throughout history have believed in exactly that thing. And God embodied in a person. The difference between idolatry and that's a good conversation. There you go. True existence. Right And that's going to be at least two or three or four or five shoe rooms right there because you just got to the crux of. What is God? My entire supposition here is I'm setting you up, and I think that's why you said omnipotent, I'm the present, I'm the powerful. I'm setting you up for that. But then, if you believed in a demonstrable God I wouldn't think that would be worthy of worship, Abe. Wouldn't describe God as anything. Exactly correct, and that's what the Rambam says.

35:18 And so you could only describe God's manifestations, but you could give him no real definitions. And that's the concept of tzimtzum in Kabbalah, that after God has created the world, He has manifestations that we then attribute to Him. But they wouldn't be Him on any level, and they would be limiting. Does that make sense? So you say that God is beyond logic, beyond time and space. But that's really the only real tool we have to figuring things out. That's exactly correct. This is the paradox of when you begin any conversation like this. If you set yourself up with a God that is beyond human comprehension. Your next step is going to be. Wait a second. I'm looking at the tools in my tool belt, and the one that I have is logic, science, being able to measure things. So how am I supposed to relate to this thing that I'm claiming? Everything. Everything. Right.

36:06 Right. Exactly. Right. Except we're going to see there's a sixth sense. Kushnir. Do you? Sorry. So now that's a fascinating conversation. See, Kushner, now you're really appreciating the gravity of what we say when we call him Avinu Malkeinu. Now you're taking it up and toll. Now what was just this thing, and now you're ascribing to it something deeply personal, something relationship oriented. Do you see the shift you just made? That was the shift called Judaism. He's actually not anything. And as you couldn't limit him to Avinu or Malkeinu, and by the way, Chazal were sensitive to that. That's why they said when you're going to describe God, you have to do it in an acrostic form with the olive base, because there would never be any reason to stop, because He would be all of those things and more and none of them So Chazal appreciated the gravity of saying anything about God But you're right; we're really speaking about God's manifestations.

37:15 Right now It's almost always going to be a separate discussion, just because we're at the very tip. But go ahead anyway. Well For the most part, people are just interested in what is really only curated information. Or people want what they want from what they want to call it. Because they grew up right accidents of history. We happen to be born in this family. So if we have that accidental history, and then let's not forget that we have a class like this in the first place. I'm saying, we have classes. We have the class right now where we're discussing all these doubts that we have, all these beliefs, may or may not be true, like all that stuff. Can I just ask you a question? No. But you said that, and I think you meant it. And I'll tell you why I think you meant it.

38:17 Because for most of us The way it goes is like this: We grew up in a very black and white system. I don't mean black and white colors. I mean black and white thinking. And you sort of fall into one of two categories: those that believe and those that don't believe. And then you get labeled very often by the educational system as he's a non-believer, or at the very least, he's agnostic about his belief. He doesn't know. He's not sure. And so then what happens is you start getting dealt with by the system. There's always that Rebbe in the system that builds the relationship and he puts his arm around you and maybe has these amazing conversations. He's read a couple of books, by the way. Today, with the internet, most 16-year-olds have access to books that are at least as knowledgeable as the rabbi that's talking to them. And then you start getting labeled as that person. First of all, I would not blame anyone for having these questions.

39:07 And I certainly wouldn't separate them. I am endowed with abilities only you and God possess. I want you to know I think the entire system of reward and punishment needs real thought. And I think most of us grow up with a very Christian version of reward and punishment. When we speak about God blaming, that to me just sounds very off from the way that I see Judaism. Are you of the opinion that If one word of creation, he like his Olam Habah? See, but then that goes back to that question of what does that even mean? What is Olam Habah? Right. So I'm hesitant to answer only because I haven't given us. I could say yes or no, and then half of you will be thrown because you'd be like. And this happens a lot. Guys walk out of the chair and they go, "I heard Rube Burg say that if you break Shabbat, it doesn't impact your Olam Habah" "Right?" And then I've heard you said that you don't believe in God. That is true. I have said that. I even said this year, God does not exist.

40:04 You see what I mean by that? It's like Elon, I think what you're really saying, which is an amazing thing, is if we're going to go down this route, let's get really sensitive to every single move that Judaism is making. And once you say this amorphous thing exists and it has desires, what's the consequence of going against those desires? And if there is a consequence of going against those desires, how does that system work? And does it take into account the initial challenge of belief to begin with? So I would definitely think that it does, but I need a lot of things before that to get there. I've got seven minutes left, so I just need to hold you guys off. You're welcome to ask me questions after. Because I just got to finish up this section, and then we'll be ready. So far, what have we said?

40:51 Just to highlight the things that we've said. We spoke a lot about what the differences between knowledge and belief might be. I haven't suggested yet what I believe they are, but whatever it is, we have to really understand how we could come to believe in something that we can't define. One thing we suggested so far is there's a tradition. For whatever reason, they'll say there was some mass revelation, and we're choosing, for whatever reason, to believe in that tradition. The advantage is that it lacks the arrogance of saying I can define God. And the disadvantage is it's not personal. Let's go the opposite way for a second. This is called derech hakira. Hakira means investigation. The Rambam says in the very beginning of his mission of Torah that there is a mitzvah. Le da sheyes sham matsui risham to know not to believe to know that there is a first cause from which everything else came out.

41:50 So what would you say? Does the Rambam tell you to believe or to know? The Rambam tells you to know. The question is, what would constitute knowledge? In the Sefer Amitzvos, the Rambam brings down this mitzvah, but what's the problem? What language was the Sefer Amitzvos written in? Anybody know? Was it written in Hebrew? It was not written in Aramaic. It was written in Arabic. Because that was the language of the time. The Rambam wrote a Sefer Hamitzvos in Arabic, and it was classically translated into Hebrew as Lahamin. Shieisha Mitzuy Rishon. But the truth is, when we went back to the Arabic, as R. Kapach did, and he was an expert in Arabic, he said that they mistranslated the word And really the word meant Leda Shieisha Mitzuy Rishon, as the Rambam said in the Yad Chazaka. So the Rambam holds that there is a mitzvah to know that God exists. What would be the advantage of knowing that God exists?

42:47 Questioner. What was that? The words are really challenging, Abe. Because if the advantage of Mithora was it dealt with the hubris issue, but the disadvantage was it was impersonal. If I know that something exists, what's my personal relationship with it? That's gonna now. Now we can start to talk. Then the challenge in Gethsemane and all that is gone. Maybe. Because if everyone knows that God exists, no one's gonna. Here, Sam. I think what you're highlighting is when I know things are bad for me in general. We stay away from them. But once you start to boil down to it, it's like, I know I scientifically know that going to Papagayo's all-you-can-eat. It's not an accident that Papagayo's has the cleanest bathrooms in all of Israel. I don't know if any of you have been to Papagayo's. The bathrooms are immaculate. You know why? Because people are constantly running back and forth between the table, it is a bad idea to go to an all-you-can-eat and keep that thing on green and just see how much meat you can put inside of yourself. I know it to be true.

44:20 And yet I did it twice this past summer You go to your average addict and you say that needle that you're about to put in your body, it very well might kill you. It's certainly going to kill brain cells that may not come back. And yet, what does that addict do? Plunge away, right? It's not an accident that the Torah tells us about Chet Aega, which happened immediately after the supposed mass revelation. You could know something to be true and behave very differently. So far, so good. They didn't know it. They didn't know it until they did the thing. They knew it and then they lost. How does that work? I know that the world is round. I'm gonna live my life based on that. I'm never gonna deviate from this. The world is round, and then some super-respected scientist comes out with a thing that is actually flat.

45:19 Or at least it's not as round as we thought it was. Then you might. Sam. That's gonna be a really important point. That's an excellent point. In other words, as follows: If you go with Misora, and that's the way you decide to believe in this, then it's deeply impersonal. If you go with Chakira, then what are you saying? I have an immediate relationship with this thing as I would with anything that I have experiential, real knowledge of. The disadvantage is You've entered into the realm of saying that your mind can comprehend something that is beyond, or perhaps beyond human comprehension. And if somebody now asks you a question In Derech Hakira Maybe you know the answer But maybe you don't. And if your entire logical basis for believing in God is thrown because somebody asked you a question, what happens? Now you're out the window.

46:16 And I'll tell you a quick story. This actually happened very recently to a very dear beloved Talmud, a guy who's an amazing person Like an amazing person. And he was in Shiyurim here in Mevaseret, and he decided more to build in line exclusively with the logic approach. And then he went. He spoke to a family member, and his family member started asking him questions that he didn't know the answer to. Or he thought he knew the answers. But then, when he started thinking a little bit more deeply, all of a sudden, he realized, 'Hey, wait a second! I don't really have great answers for these questions.' And he called me up in a panic and he says, 'My entire belief system just came crumbling down.' So if you're only believing based on logic You're in a very precarious position because right now science says one thing but we don't know. In a hundred years from now, they might come and say something else. We used to believe that the atom was the smallest thing, and we cut that open, killed a bunch of Japanese people, and now we know that there's something smaller than that.

47:15 It's not really fundamentally different. Once you choose logic exclusively, you're in dangerous territory because logic might be shifting. We might learn things. I believe we will learn things a hundred years from now that are very different than the things we know now. Let me just finish this up, and then you'll ask me questions. We have to finish up. It's four o'clock. Our goal, as we're going to see, is to have both. In this year, we're not going to take one path exclusively. And you'll see that, in my opinion, the best way of creating a well-rounded approach towards God is because you'll have the advantages of both. You'll have the advantage of recognizing the limitations of the human mind, and yet you'll engage the mind that God gave you, that the Rambam says is a mitzvah. Lay the sheisham matzirishah. What if we do have questions? Does anybody say? Is there anybody? Is there any strain of Jewish thought that says if you have questions, you have to say no? I believe, and I have no. I'm not supposed to have questions. Is there anybody in Jewish history, historically, that we've ever said, yeah, that's a position? The answer is absolutely not.

48:15 There were people that didn't have questions, and we said you don't have questions, that's fine. But there was never a strain in Jewish history where they said If you have questions, you should shut that person up. There's always been. Mesorah of asking questions. If you do have a natural belief in God Good for you. You have a natural belief in God. Maybe this class is irrelevant to you. Maybe it's only for a dam mashtashev lapi kares. You're going to have to respond to somebody. But I think there's still value, even for those who have a natural belief in God, in using their mind. It should never be an excuse to turn off your mind.